Sunday, October 20, 2013

Socrates meets Jesus

This ironic conversation between Socrates and Jesus  was posted on the website of Italian atheists .
Socrates: Good morning, Jesus, they told me of your wonderful teachings. I am a modest philosopher here in Athens. They told me that you have a great wisdom and this is certainly demonstrated by the crowd of admirers who follows you on the streets. If you have a moment to spare, I'd like to enlighten me with the answers to the complex dilemmas with which I have fought all my life.

Jesus: I am a fisher of men looking for followers. I bring the truth of God to all men. Search and find, ask and you shall be answered, knock and it shall be opened. 

Socrates: There is a basic problem that has always occupied my mind so predominant. Although it was for me always an insurmountable obstacle in the search for truth and meaning of things, I'm sure with your knowledge you will find it simple and think I'm an old fool. I always wanted to live nobly and honorably, but it seems to have just gone through my life without even knowing what it was honorable and noble. With my limited ability to understand, it seems to me often that life, even with all its noise and fury, has no real meaning. Please tell me: How should a man live, what is the purpose of life. 

Jesus: Serve and worship God 

Socrates: What kind of God? 

Jesus: There is only one God 

Socrates: Oh. You should live in Athens. We do have several to choose from. 

Jesus: There is only one true God 

Socrates: Sure. And what is the true God? 

Jesus: The true God is the Lord your God. 

Socrates: Yes, but who is the Lord your God? Or what is it? 

Jesus: is the infinite wisdom, love, compassion, peace and mercy. is the creator of heaven and earth and all things in the universe. 

Socrates: Of all things? 

Jesus: Yes, all things. He is omnipotent. is the master and controller and builder of all things. is omnipresent. Nothing can happen that he does not know in advance. 

Socrates: He created the pestilence, war, death, suffering and evil? 

Jesus: No. These things and all other evils and tragedies come from the Devil, the prince of darkness, or by human weakness and evil nature. God is all good, and is free from evil. Only good can come from God 

Socrates: And pray, who would be the devil? Surely it must be a god to be able to send these powerful disasters on mankind and yet you just said that there is one God You also said that everything that exists comes from God, and now you say that only good comes from God and all evil comes from someone called "the devil." This seems like a contradiction. I'm afraid that your religion is too complicated to understand for this old man. Yet I would be an enthusiastic student and I would try in every way to understand, if you will help me. Please explain: who is the devil and how is it that all things are from God and yet are not from God? 

Jesus: The Devil is a fallen angel, ambitious. He rebelled against God and want to pervert his work. 

Socrates: In the name of Zeus, what is an angel? 

Jesus: An angel is an angel. 

Socrates: is clear: it is an identity. Socrates is Socrates. But, you see, does not mean anything to me, who are without experience of your religion. Although it is certainly true, it is linked to anything that I can understand. Compare it to something that I am familiar. 

Jesus: An angel is an angel. 

Socrates: Please, forgive my foolish ignorance. No less an authority than you. I've never seen nor heard of an angel. They told me that you had many strange visions when you wandered in the desert for 40 days without eating. Please tell me, what these angels look like? 

Jesus: Have the wings. 

Socrates: Even the horseflies. You can be a bit 'more specific? 

Jesus: They look like people, but they have wings. 

Socrates: What else? They can fly, I presume. 

Jesus: Yes, the wings are used to that. 

Socrates: Sure ... I should have known. You say you are like men. How are they different from men?

Jesus: They are much better than men and do not die. 

Socrates: How much better than men? 

Jesus: More virtuous and more powerful. Much more powerful.

Socrates: So are superhuman. 

Jesus: Yes, absolutely. 

Socrates: So they are superhuman and immortal. We call these beings in Athens "gods". 

Jesus: No! God is more powerful than them. 

Socrates: Even Zeus for us is more powerful than the other gods of Olympus, but the others are still by definition. How would you define the term "God"? 

Jesus: God is the creator of everything. is omnipotence, knowledge, wisdom, and is the epitome of justice, mercy, compassion, good and peace. 

Socrates: These qualities, however, are not necessarily consistent. It is not possible for a person to be just, peaceful and compassionate, all together or in a single situation. If a person or a nation deserve a punishment for the rules of justice, you have to punish her or him to war, but this would be a violation of the rule of peace and mercy. No being can have all these qualities, because they contradict each other. Can not exist together in the same person at the same time. is as if a man revolved right and left at the same intersection at the same time, but remain whole and unitary.

Jesus: God works in mysterious and wonderful ways. 

Socrates: You seem to have so many of us like to Athens, just do not call them gods. 

Jesus: No! God is omnipotent. 

Socrates: So the only difference is the amount of power? 

Jesus: No. God is better and more virtuous than them. Sin is impossible for him. 

Socrates: What is sin? 

Jesus: is an act of disobedience to God 

Socrates: I understand how this God can not sin, because he can not disobey himself. But since sin is impossible for him, is no longer a great achievement for him to be free from sin, any more than to be a rock unable to move. just a problem of definitions. What do these angels? 

Jesus: Running errands for God 

Socrates: Why, if God is omnipotent, he needs others to do errands for him? 

Jesus: So he likes. 

Socrates: So are his slaves? 

Jesus: No, his serve voluntarily. 

Socrates: What happens if his do not serve him voluntarily? 

Jesus: There were several angels led by Satan, the devil, who rebelled against God and were cast out of heaven for a torment and eternal punishment. 

Socrates: What is heaven? 

Jesus: is a wonderful place in the highest. The streets are paved with gold. Everything is peaceful and beautiful there. God lives there and all those who believe in God go there when they die. Men have eternal life, and he is given the wings and playing harps and worship God in eternal bliss and happiness. is the purpose and goal of all human life to go to heaven when you die. 

Socrates: Very reminiscent of the tales of those who ate the lotus flowers. If this is the purpose of life, we could not simply intoxicated by wine or drugs and feel so forever, as the beggars and drunks we see the other side of town? 

Jesus: The Bible says thou shalt not drink wine or other strong drink. 

Socrates: If the only purpose of a man's life is to go to heaven, because they simply do not kill to go there? 

Jesus: You do not kill. 

Socrates: If God had wanted man to go to heaven, why put man on earth? Why 'did not simply put man in paradise from the beginning? I find it hard to believe that man with all his abilities, desires and complexity have been created simply to sit and bow down, worship and revere. It certainly is not, and there was not even a tyrant so vain and proud to be desired that those subject to him respectfully bow down and revere and slavishly from dawn to dusk, not to mention all eternity. I can certainly understand why Satan wanted to rebel against a society as static, regimented, oppressive and boring. From what you've told me so far, I would have been at the side of Satan in rebellion, because although consider myself a humble human among humans, I could not bend over and revere and sing praises all day long to a being that threatens to punish me in eternal torment if I did not. 

Jesus: The Lord thy God is a jealous god, and thou shalt have no other gods before him. 

Socrates: Why did Satan rebel? He knew that God was as powerful as you describe it, and that would certainly have been defeated? 

Jesus: Satan rebelled because he was proud and wanted to reign in heaven. He knew part of the great power of God (which was bigger than his), but he wanted the power so much to accept any risk. 

Socrates: Satan was certainly very brave then, to fight an enemy he could not defeat. 

Jesus: Sinned because they disobeyed the will of God 

Socrates: It seems to me that the only difference between Satan and God is the amount of power. 

Jesus: God is perfect. He is all-powerful, all-knowing, and is without sin. 

Socrates: Sure. By definition is without sin, because he can not disobey himself. The only real difference between the two is the degree of power. So Satan was not wrong or committed no sin in rebellion against God, what he did wrong was losing the war. Because if he won, God would be the sinner, because God would be disobedient to Satan, who would have been better angels of God or the other, because he could not sin against himself, that is, being disobedient to himself, and he would try to be omnipotent. If Satan had won, he would become God, according to your definition, because it would be all-powerful and without sin. Who knows if this did not happen? From your description of God, I begin to suspect at this point that it happened. 

Jesus: God is more than just power and virtuous lack of sin is infinite justice, mercy, peace and compassion, and forgiveness. Satan is evil, selfish, destructive, and evil. 

Socrates: What happened to Satan after the expulsion from paradise? 

Jesus: He was sent to hell by God and was tormented and tortured for all eternity. 

Socrates: What is Hell and Satan stayed there because it is so painful and unpleasant? 

Jesus: God shut him in hell and he was not allowed to go away. God created Hell as a place to punish Satan and all the men who had no faith in God is a fire that burns for eternity, torture, agony, and torment all sinners who have not asked for forgiveness from God and not have faith in him to be there for all eternity, to be tortured by the devil. 

Socrates: If God were fair or merciful, how could you do this to an enemy who fought in battle? Why does not God simply forgave Satan after the defeat as they usually men with vanquished nations after they have been defeated? Humanity seems more compassionate than God in victory, why not propina to win these terrible torments for a lifetime, much less for eternity. For God does not show the qualities that you describe as his justice, mercy, compassion and forgiveness toward Satan? Certainly the warlike nature of God is in marked contrast with your definition of God as being peaceful, gracious and forgives everything. 

Jesus: God works in mysterious ways, his wonders to achieve. 

Socrates: If Satan in Hell is closed, as it can lead plagues and torments humanity and why God allows it if it is all-powerful and infinite good? If God is omnipotent, why is it that allows this evil Satan to survive? Why does not destroy it? Although at this point I begin to wonder whether it is not better than the opposite. 

Jesus: God allows Satan to be free to bring plagues and torments humanity to punish man for his sin in the Garden of Eden. 

Socrates: What is the Garden of Eden? 

Jesus: When God created the first man and the first woman, Adam and Eve, placed them in the Garden of Eden. When they were created, they were pure and sinless. This is how God made them. The Garden of Eden was a wonderful haven that gave Adam and Eve everything they needed. They did not have to work, but simply to take the fruit from the branches of lush green trees. They were innocent and without problems as children and knew nothing of carnal love. It kept her company and adored and worshiped God, who visited them from time to time. 

Socrates: Why did God create mankind? 

Jesus: He was alone. 

Socrates: Why did not he simply created other angels who were his equals, rather than this lower form of life, the Man? Could it be that he wanted obsequious slaves to whom he could look down and they would be afraid of him and would have revered and worshiped? 

Jesus: Since it is our creator, we owe him our adoration, reverence and obedience. 

Socrates: The son of a criminal is obliged to be obedient to his father, or has the right and obligation to judge for himself what is good and evil? What sin, as an act of disobedience committed man in the Garden of Eden? 

Jesus: At the center of the Garden of Eden, God put the tree of knowledge. God told Adam and Eve that they should not eat of the fruit of that tree. Satan came disguised as a serpent in the Garden and told Eve that he gained great knowledge if she ate the fruit. Satan said that God had told him not to eat the fruit, because he was afraid that if they did they would become as big as him. Eve persuaded Adam to eat the fruit. When they had eaten, knew the sexual love. That was the origin of sin. 

Socrates: Knowledge is evil, because God wants  hidden? Because God wants to prevent us from coming to know? We want to keep as slaves servile lying under his foot? It seems to me that we have to thank Satan and worship him for the help he has given us. Satan appears as the Titan Prometheus, who disobeyed the orders of the gods, brought man the knowledge of the fire. For this gift to man, Prometheus as Satan was subjected to torment and torture for all eternity. Certainly the human life on earth would be worth much less without love, fire and knowledge. 

Jesus: But Satan was lying to Eve, because we would not have become as great as God by eating the fruit. There was lying simply because he wanted to destroy the work of God 

Socrates: If God is omnipotent, because he allowed Satan to enter the Garden and groped Eve? If God did not want man to eat the fruit, because they put the tree in the Garden? If God did not want that man knew sexual love, why he did it with the organs necessary for this? If God did not want men commit the original sin, because he has given men the desire for knowledge, experience, adventure and carnal love?

Jesus: God put the tree in the Garden and allowed Satan to come, because he wanted to test mankind. 

Socrates: You said that God is omniscient: he knows everything that happens before it happens. 
  Certainly God knew that man would behave in any situation. 

Jesus: God gave man free will. For the man was also possible to be virtuous and obey God, as sin and disobey the word of God 

Socrates: God knew that man would sin? 

Jesus: He knew that man would sin, but allowed man to have free will to make his choice. 

Socrates: God could have created man so that he could not sin? God could have created man so that he had not sinned in this particular situation? 

Jesus: Yes, because God is omnipotent he could have, but did not want the men were mere puppets: he wanted the men had free will.

Socrates: God could have created man with two heads and three-legged or in any other way, if he wanted to? 

Jesus: God could have created man in any way he wanted to. 

Socrates: God created man in the way he wanted? God wanted man to have a head, two legs, and it looked exactly as it appears today? 

Jesus: Of course, God is perfect and all-powerful: it can not make mistakes. 

Socrates: So God did not make a mistake and created man exactly how he wanted it? 

Jesus: Yes 

Socrates: Then you and I were created exactly as God intended us to be? And Adam and Eve were created exactly as God intended
to be? 

Jesus: Yes, it's like I told you.

Socrates: All that is part of the man comes from God? 

Jesus: Yes, God is the master and controller and creator of all. 

Socrates: The devil or any other force
created a part of man? 

Jesus: No. God is the sole creator of all. 

Socrates: So if God created man's eyes, legs and mind, he also created the desires of man. All his desires, even the desire for knowledge and gender. Because man has sinned? 

Jesus: Sin through his weaknesses and his evil nature. 

Socrates: The nature of man is the man, just as the hands and feet are part of man? 

Jesus: Yes, the nature of man is the man. 

Socrates: Who has created man? 

Jesus: God 

Socrates: Who created the hands and feet of man? 

Jesus: God 

Socrates: Who gave man two hands and two feet and has created exactly as it is today and exactly as it was in the days of Adam and Eve? 

Jesus: God 

Socrates: Who created the nature of man? 

Jesus: God 

Socrates: Who gave man his evil nature and weaknesses? God, because everything that is part of man came from God and from God alone. 

Jesus: God gave man free will. 

Socrates: Who would have it, the man had two hands, the devil?

Jesus: No. God has willed that man had two hands. 

Socrates: Who would have it, the man had a weakness and evil nature, the devil? No. God would have it, the man had a weakness and evil nature. If humanity has defects or is evil or weak, it is because God put flaws or weaknesses, and she wanted us to be. Let me tell you another parable. Have you ever seen a bird kill a fish in the sea? Who brought the flying fish into the clutches of the bird and killed him? Who is to blame, my friend, when the judge himself is brought to the bar? 

Jesus: Man has free will. God did not have to sin. Simply given him the opportunity to be virtuous or sinful. The man would have no value to God if he did as a mere puppet I can not do anything but good. He wanted to give the man a chance to be good or evil for his merit and choice. 

Socrates: it is absurd for God to punish man after creating it. it is as if Homer had written an ode on a pig and then whipped and lashed the pages or have hurled towards an eternal fire that never wears out, because he does not like the qualities of that animal. Or as if a sculptor has made a perfect statue of a pig and then he whipped for all eternity because they do not like the features of this animal. 

Jesus: God did not create man with an evil nature that has predetermined his sin. 

Socrates: Then who did it? 

Jesus: God created man to be innocent, and of course good. God put the man in a paradise, the Garden of Eden. He gave man free will, and allowed Satan to enter the Garden of Eden to test mankind. God does not predetermine the sin of man. 

Socrates: But God created everything that went into this combination, situation and environment. When he created each of the elements or ingredients of this situation, he knew exactly how he would react with each other in all circumstances, for it is all-knowing. He wanted every element was exactly as it was, because it was all-powerful and could not make any mistakes. it is as if a scientist or a doctor combining different ingredients in a medicine, which although harmless in itself, when combined become a powerful poison and then administering to a patient, denying any responsibility for his death. Precisely in this way God combined things: an innocent man, a tree of knowledge, a beautiful garden and an angel. 

Jesus: All have sinned and are unworthy of God's glory 

Socrates: It seems to me that the Lord your God has created man just to watch him suffer. This deal of Satan, the Garden of Eden and free will is simply a facade. God simply wanted an excuse to harass, stalk, harass and oppress humanity. If an omnipotent and omniscient God creates everything and allows his creatures to act in a certain way, he wants exactly that these act in a determined way and is solely responsible for the results. 

Jesus: I warn you, God is not to be laughed at. Do not talk like that or you'll be thrown into a fiery furnace where   teeth in eternal torment and torture. 

Socrates: I thought that the gods of Olympus were bad and unreasonable, but they seem real lambs merciful and tolerant comparison of this thy God, which haunts you and torture you for all eternity for doing what in which he will force due how did you and your environment. 

Jesus: Oh, give thanks to the Lord for He is good and His mercy is everlasting.

Socrates: Because if it is a god of peace and mercy, haunts humanity and allows, even encourages and asks, bloodshed on earth and allows, even encourages Satan groped and torture humanity: why did you say that nothing happens to him not only know, but who wants that to happen? An omnipotent being who knows everything and created everything determines everything, because he knows how his creation will behave. 

Jesus: God gave man free will, because he did not want it to be a mere puppet. God did not want man sinned. God was very disappointed that the man had sinned. 

Socrates: You can not prove that God disappointment, because he knows the nature of man and of everything else he has created. Why is omnipotent, he wanted man sinned. In fact, he forced the man to sin by creating it with certain desires and weaknesses. 

Jesus: What you say is blasphemous. God created the world and all the plants and animals for the pleasure of man. Watch the beauty of the world around you. How can you say such terrible things about God, after they gave you so much? 

Socrates: Certainly I do not believe this. How could a god so evil, sadistic and full of hatred, creating a world of such beauty? Even men who sometimes show great wickedness, at other times showing incredible strength, spirit of sacrifice and loyalty, and quality grades conflicting as mercy and justice. Your God has none of these qualities. Surely there has never been a man for what he has done vile to another man what you say that God gives to those who do not comply: torture for all eternity. Any man, no matter how badly it has been mangled, tortured and killed - as Priam which the entire stripe was killed by Agamemnon, who was in turn killed by his wife and her lover - eventually  e after torturing his enemy for years or centuries. 

Jesus: I am the way, the truth and the light. Nobody came from the Father except me. Believe in me and you will have eternal life in heaven; 
deny me and suffer eternal torture in Hell.

Socrates: If I agreed your system, I'd rather take sides with Satan against your God, even knowing that they are tormented and tortured forever. The injustice and wickedness of thy God is frightening. I've heard terrible stories of human sacrifices by savages on distant shores. I've heard tales of scary monsters, Cyclopes, Gorgons and jellyfish, but these monsters are meek and gentle as lambs, compared to those described in your book of Revelation. And you tell me about the peaceful nature, infinitely merciful and gracious the Lord God 

Jesus: We are all children of God God is our father and does not want us to sin, but must punish us when we do. is just and merciful and sends us, his children, hell, damnation and eternal torment if we have sinned. When we sin, and we want sex as Adam and Eve, he has no choice but to punish us, torturing us into the eternal fire forever. 

Socrates: You say that we are children of God it is a monster to torment their children to have eyes, legs and desires that he gave them. Manipulators that these demons are no longer believed, because they deceive us with puns and while keeping the promises made to our ear break them in our hope. I do not see purpose, nor reason, nor truth, nor mercy, nor justice; nothing if not capricious and naked power. In fact, human beings, with all their whims, selfishness and weaknesses, seem to have more quality of your God Your God is a sadistic and psychotic demon. 

Jesus: We are mere humans and we can not understand the infinite mysteries of God is our duty to be faithful, to believe and follow it. It is not for us to reason why, but to do and die. 

Socrates: I do not think? But because it gave us minds? How can we determine how to live and what is the purpose of life? What we are doing now as we speak? Why have you spent all his life teaching people? Why 'you risked your life by disobeying the orders of the Romans? 

Jesus: We are saved by faith, man is not proud. 

Socrates: Faith. What do you mean faith? 

Jesus: We have to believe without asking for proof. We need not doubt like Thomas. If we believe in God, are we rewarded for all the trials and tribulations thousands of times, when we get to heaven. 

Socrates: You say that we are to believe whatever is said, without investigating it or examine it, we need to be gullible? If I did this, I would give my bag to every man in the street that I promise to  multiplied by a thousand. I would be stupid to do as you say. And here you're asking me to give you just the money, but to devote my entire life to an end and purpose, regardless of the value of the commitment. A thief asks you for money or life. You ask me life threatening me with torture and promising heaven. I'm no fool gullible and docile to take me where it is said, with empty promises and threats.  

Jesus: The meek shall inherit the earth. 

Socrates: The myths are killed and enslaved the women and children as a defeated nation. 

Jesus: You must not questioning God! 

Socrates: I have never met this person, and therefore I not
questioning him   . I'm questioning   you,   to determine whether or not you really represent him.  

Jesus: You have to believe in the Bible, Scripture, the Word of God by faith, not expecting to be able to understand and without asking for proof. 

Socrates: it is impossible for a man not to choose. Do you know that there are many thousands of religions in the world? If we believed by faith, we should accept them all, yet they are all different, and so it would be impossible. It would be like believing that the world is spherical and flat at the same time. Certainly do not practice what you preach, because otherwise you would have believed that the Jewish religion and in the Old Testament were right and you would not have started to preach this your new heresy. Or yesterday when the priests of Athena warned you in the street to stop preaching your heresy, you should believe in the religion of the Greek Olympic Gods because he existed before and you should believe that by faith because you've been told that it was true. 

Jesus: We are saved by faith, man is not proud. 

Socrates: Let me give you a specific example. Suppose that the oracle of Delphi to tell me that a certain person is guilty of raping and murdering my wife and that I should kill him or he will kill me, afraid that I discover his crime and kill him. You tell me, "Thou shalt not kill." Telling me that I believe by faith in whatever I tell you. If I follow your exhortation I have to kill that man, because of my faith in the oracle of Delphi and does not have to kill this man for my faith in the Lord God But I can not at the same time to kill and do not kill that man, because is a contradiction. So I can not believe in the oracle of Delphi and the Lord God Therefore, it is impossible for me to believe something by faith alone. There is an intellectual choice that you and I and all human beings do, whether voluntary or not, to choose what to believe. What would you rather do: make your choice thinking, discussing and considering all aspects of the problem or blindly denying that there is a need for choice? This choice is the most important in the life of a man, because the answer to the question "What is the purpose of life?" determines the whole course of a man's life. If a man has to direct his every move according to his religion, as you suggest, then you certainly will have to put a lot of effort in the choice of religion. Let me tell you a parable: if I had to go from one city to another on a matter that involves your entire life, you would be wise to consider all paths, though some of these are frequented by robbers, if by chance there is a nearest town or safer to go to, or even if there is then a city after all? 

Jesus: If you honestly want to know the truth about God, creation and the purpose of life, there is a very easy way to discover this truth. All you have to do is ask God to come into your heart. If you sincerely want to know the truth about God, the Holy Spirit will descend upon your being and you will become one with God at that moment earn a heavenly knowledge and peace, and when you die, you go to heaven and live forever in happiness and contentment. 

Socrates: I long to know the truth. What I have to do and say in order to gain this knowledge and wisdom? How can I contact him? 

Jesus: Say, "Lord, come into my heart and give me the wisdom to understand the truth." 

Socrates: You say that by simply repeating this I will have the knowledge of the purpose of life? 

Jesus: Yes Seek the Lord, and shall find, ask and you shall be answered, knock and it shall be opened. God has promised to show the truth to anyone who asks. 

Socrates: Lord, come into my heart and give me the wisdom to understand the truth. 

Jesus: There, you see. Now thank the Lord for giving you eternal life. 

Socrates: Nothing happened. I do not know more than I knew before about the purpose of life.

Jesus: Then you were not sincere. Not that you really wanted God to come into your heart to show you the truth. You did not have faith that come into your heart. 

Socrates: Really wanted to know the truth. I have dedicated my entire life to the study of philosophy and reason. I want to know the purpose of life more than life itself. is an answer I'm looking for since I saw the sun the first time. If you can not find the will continue to try until the day of my death. You may not have heard me. I have to ask stronger? 

Jesus: Did not find the answer because you have no faith. If a man has a faith the size of a mustard seed can move a mountain and gets everything he wants. 

Socrates: This is impossible. Any of the people who followed you here today have never had a relative or friend who is ill and on the verge of death? Certainly if they were good Christians would have preferred that relative or friend was not sick or dying. Surely no one is so insensitive to say that he never wanted a friend lived. Hence it follows that no Christian in every age it has never had faith in God, or that God was lying. 

Jesus: The Lord give and the Lord take away, blessed be the name of the Lord. 

Socrates: I'll introduce a parable to prove that there never on a Christian or a Jew who had faith and to prove that God was lying when he promised to come to the heart of man to teach the purpose of life. First, would you agree that Hell is worse than any earthly misfortune can? 

Jesus: Yes of course. 

Socrates: And, you did not say that all men are sinners and have failed to God's glory? 

Jesus: Yes 

Socrates: All Christians and the Jews who have faith believe that they're going to hell if they sin. Allow me to introduce this parable. Every Christian is like a man standing on top of a cliff: he knows that if he commits a sin, he will fall to his death, or worse, to the eternal torment. You said that Hell is worse than any earthly misfortune can. No matter how severe are his misfortunes or his earthly desires, any man who is a faithful Christian, would commit a sin, that would jump off the cliff of eternal torment. You said that all people, including Christians and Jews, are sinners. It follows that no Christian or Jew from the beginning of time has never really believed that he would go to hell. Why 'if he believed, would not sin: it would not be blown off the cliff if he believed that Hell and eternal torment would have waited there. All men jump off the cliff, all men sin. So not one in these centuries really believed in you. Therefore, God has no right to expect them to behave in a Christian way or who have faith in him. Therefore, God has no right to punish them or send them to Hell. So your God is not fair. So your God is not God 

Jesus: Look at the world around you. It does not prove that God exists? See the beautiful and benevolent nature that makes you strong and healthy and gives you the sun for heat and the forest and the fields for food. You should not worship God for everything he has done for you? 

Socrates: I know that nature is all good and benevolent, but who was that hailstorm that broke my window? 

Jesus: Simply because there is evil in the world, this does not negate the good: you have to thank God for that. God must exist because, from where did the world would be if he had not created?

Socrates: It is not necessarily your God who created the world. There are thousands of other priests who claim that their God did. Just because I do not have the answer, does not mean that I have to accept your not examined. Could I ask you to think logically that Zeus created the world. Even if I agree that God created the world, this is the end of the definition of the qualities of God and we can not logically proceed from there to assume that the other aspects of your definition of God is correct. 

Jesus: Wait, do not go! You must save your soul from eternal damnation. Accept God into your heart. I'm not leaving until you tell me so. 

Socrates: Yes These are just idle thoughts of an old man. You are probably right, because you have so many followers. And who am I, an old boring, to precede reason and philosophy to the voices of the multitude. 

Jesus: We thank God for giving you eternal life. 

Socrates goes away.  

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